Any plumbers on here?

[5.0calypso93lx]

I don't know a whole lot about plumbing to begin with, but I have a few questions about the sewage setup in the house I'm buying.

I'll try and describe it as best I can and I will get pics as soon as I can.

I'm not exactly sure why this was done(called the city of new richmond and found that there were no permits besides the initial build of the house, but the work was definitely professionally done, cement was dug out and recemented making this bigger hole), but basically the house has this oversized hole in the back corner of the basement with a big iron lid bolted down into the cement. When I say oversized, if I had to guess it's probably 1.5-2x the size of a normal sump pump hole.

On top of the big iron lid are two smaller iron lids that have two sewage pumps mounted to them. From those pumps there are PVC pipes that go up the wall and out to the side of the house and what appears to be up to the street to the public sewage line.

It's hard to tell, but it appears that all of the sewage in the house is being funneled down through PVC into this big hole in the basement then being pumped out to the street. The reason I say it's hard to tell because some of the PVC piping goes into the cement as soon as it comes down through the floor and I can't see where it's going. I can look in the big hole though and can see an opening where a pvc pipe is that is coming from the general direction of where the pvc initially goes into the concrete.

When I first went and looked at the house it appeared that maybe one of the pumps was not working as it was unbolted from the big iron lid, removed and laid back against the basement wall.

I had an inspector come out and inspect the house and we re-installed the pump and turned the power on and it appears to actually be working. It's hard to tell though other than just holding the pipe the comes out of the pump to feel if there is water coming up through that pipe.

Is there any way to test these pumps to see if they're working??

I don't know if someone removed the pump because it was defective or maybe it was needed for winterization(house has been vacant for two years)?

There's also a black box mounted to the wall near where this whole setup is. It's got this red light and a loud alarm on it(when I had the power turned on we flipped the breaker and it came on, but immediately turned off). I'm assuming it's an alarm system if one of the pumps fail? The wiring from the pumps go into this black box.

Why would someone have had this installed? Is it because the house is below the sewage line and maybe it had difficulty pumping the sewage out to the street? Are there any watchouts for a setup like this?

The house is only 5 years old and there are zero signs of any flooding ever in the basement so I'm hoping it was done for some type of preventative maintenance. From what I've heard from the neighbors, the houses across the street flooded at one point so the previous owner of my house may have done it so their basement wouldn't flood?

[Blowpastyou]

Is your main sewer line going through the wall in the basement and not out under the slab? If it runs through the wall that means that is an injection pit. If theres a bathroom in your basement and you have a hung sewer,(main drain running through the wall) then you have to have an injection pit. The drains from the bathroom downstairs run in to the injection pit and are pumped up to the sewer line. One of the lines is for sewage and the other is probably a vent.

The box mounted on the wall is probably a battery backup once you put power back to it, if it has a bad battery or no battery connection it will make an annoying beep. Post pics up, or give me a call. Ide be happy to answer any questions you may have. 937...681....0911. Thanks, Eddie.

[5.0calypso93lx]

Is your main sewer line going through the wall in the basement and not out under the slab? If it runs through the wall that means that is an injection pit. If theres a bathroom in your basement and you have a hung sewer,(main drain running through the wall) then you have to have an injection pit. The drains from the bathroom downstairs run in to the injection pit and are pumped up to the sewer line. One of the lines is for sewage and the other is probably a vent.

The box mounted on the wall is probably a battery backup once you put power back to it, if it has a bad battery or no battery connection it will make an annoying beep. Post pics up, or give me a call. Ide be happy to answer any questions you may have. 937...681....0911. Thanks, Eddie.

There is not a bathroom in the basement. It's completely unfinished.

I'll get some pics tonight or tomorrow to show what I'm talking about better. Thanks for the help man, I appreciate it. It seems like a weird setup but somebody had to spend some serious $$$ to have this done.

[RACEME]

It could also be a sewage grinder pump. Some areas require sewage to be run thru a grinder pump before it can be sent out to the main city sewer line.

[5.0calypso93lx]

It could also be a sewage grinder pump. Some areas require sewage to be run thru a grinder pump before it can be sent out to the main city sewer line.

I'm not sure. I do know however that the neighbors on the street in front of my house do not have this setup and have a normal sump pump.

I'll take some pics, I think that will best help show what's going on.

[RACEME]

Then it is probably what the others are thinking in a helper pump to get the stuff out of the house.

[84stang]

Sounds like the same pump I have to get stuff out of the basement to the septic tank. It is a grinder pump that chews the stuff up before pumping it out.

[5.0calypso93lx]

I forgot all about this thread until tonight. I came home to the alarm going off on the box down near this setup in the basement. According to the error message on the box, it said depth =21.15 inches. I could feel through the pipes that both pumps were working and were in fact constantly running. After watching them for a bit the level started to go back down and is now down under 20 inches and the alarm has gone off.

I'm not really sure what caused that but i'm going to call the city of New Richmond tomorrow to see if there were any known backups with the city sewage.

I'm always getting a really bad smell in the basement and I think it's coming from this setup. I know one of the small caps around the rearward pipe coming up out of the manhole is broken and I'm thinking the odor could be coming up around that. I'm going to try and call the place that's listed on the box tomorrow to see if I can get replacement parts.

Here are a few pics:

http://i446.photobucket.com/albums/qq188/bad306lx/IMG_2096.jpg
http://i446.photobucket.com/albums/qq188/bad306lx/IMG_2095.jpg
http://i446.photobucket.com/albums/qq188/bad306lx/IMG_2094.jpg

[cobrajoe]

That looks more like a sump pump set up.

[DSSKing68]

I agree..looks like a sump pump with a back-up pump and a level monitor maybe?? I see a 4" cleanout in the floor probably for your sewage line.

[bobtsgt]

pretty much what Mark says. Do you want me to come out after work and investigate it?

[5.0calypso93lx]

Bob I appreciate it, but I've got the guy from All Drains on his way out here at 1 to check it out. I woke up this morning to the alarm going off again, but this time it said 29.75" instead of 21.15" like it did last night when the alarm went off the first time.

I did the NASTY task of pulling one of the smaller covers off to find the water level almost to the very very top. I moved everything in the basement away from that area and went outside to see if I could see water draining out into the creek behind my house. Nothing. So I searched on here for plumber and called that guy. Pretty sure the 2" drain pipe exiting the house is clogged up. Both pumps have been on non-stop for two straight days. I'm worried those are going to burn up soon and I think those are about $300 a pop.

The water level has slowly been dropping. It's come down about .2" the past hour. So luckily I don't think the basement is going to flood. It's not finished anyway but that would still suck.

Ahhhhh the joys of being a home owner....

[SATURNV]

High end sump pump setup...

[aaron92fox]

yes that is a sewer pit.... has 2 pumps in it. one should be set clear down at the bottom of the pit the 2nd should be a lil higher on a stand maybe? and should have a alarm float in there allso to let you know that your first pump failed and your 2nd pump kicked on and is now doing all the pumping. that pipe in the back is your vent pipe. which should go back up and tie in to the other vents in the house and out the roof.

the only thing that should be goin in to the pit down there should be any bath rooms down stairs? depends on how its plumbed. i have seen where they plumb every thing in to them then pump them out side like was talked about b4.

im a plumber from clinton county and i know that codes are alot different in all countys. but thats what i see with your setup you have from around here. if this helps any.

[motox159]

We have a set-up like that in another part of the plant that collects waste water from our QC lab. These guys are right, one line should be to the bottom of the pit and one 3/4 to 1/2 way down. The higher one does act as a secondary pump once your level indicator (the alarm) hits, it will kick it on. I would think that your line going out from the pit should be 3 1/2" pipe minimum? That may be the reason the pumps can't keep up with the flow into the tank. Depending on the pump it can also lose it's prime, a bleeder valve with a line going back into the tank would maybe help on that. As far as the pumps go, check out Northern Tool and Equiptment. They sell some heavy duty pumps for industrial that are not as pricey.

aaron92fox pretty much said it. Being from Clinton County myself, my GF's parents set up is the same with everything plumbed into the tank/pit and then pumped out. Good luck fella.

[5.0calypso93lx]

yes that is a sewer pit.... has 2 pumps in it. one should be set clear down at the bottom of the pit the 2nd should be a lil higher on a stand maybe? and should have a alarm float in there allso to let you know that your first pump failed and your 2nd pump kicked on and is now doing all the pumping. that pipe in the back is your vent pipe. which should go back up and tie in to the other vents in the house and out the roof.

the only thing that should be goin in to the pit down there should be any bath rooms down stairs? depends on how its plumbed. i have seen where they plumb every thing in to them then pump them out side like was talked about b4.

im a plumber from clinton county and i know that codes are alot different in all countys. but thats what i see with your setup you have from around here. if this helps any.

We have a winner.

First off, to answer your second paragraph, anything that uses water inside the house from the upper two floors is going down into this hole first. Bathrooms, shower, sink, etc. We were able to see where everything is funneled down into one 4" pipe where it then goes into the basement floor and over to this hole where the grinder pumps are.

You guys are also correct in that the pumps are staggered so that one pump is more of a backup. They appear to be the green zoaler (sp?) pumps, but it was hard to tell.

Duane from All Drains came out yesterday and helped me out. He was actually a bit taken back but this type of setup in a residence but after seeing how everything was plumbed and how low the house is compared to the public sewage line near the street, it makes sense why this was installed.

Unfortunately, and what still has me a bit nervous is that the "real" problem wasn't definitively found.

As you follow the 2" pipe that comes after the "T" of the grinder pumps in the hole, that 2" pipe then follows the ceiling and eventually exits the house through a sidewall in the foundation. That 2" pipe doesn't have a service section anywhere at all. There also isn't any type of service spout outside the house either. The only service section is way up near the street.

Because of this, Duane was thinking about cutting that 2" pipe where it exits the wall to add a service section. Since the water level in the hole was so high, probably only an 1" from overflowing, we decided to use that little sump pump sitting next to everything to pump the crap, literally, that was in the hole out into the back yard via the window directly above this setup (just above where the pic cuts off). The house is on a hill so it is a downhill slope out back as well as raining, so I didn't really have any other choice.

Duane removed the level sensor cover to put the sump pump in to get everything out so we didn't have a complete nasty mess in the basement. When he did this, the computer thought that the water level had lowered and in turn shut the pumps off. Unfortunately, the level sensor has a power cord and it wasn't long enough to allow it to be removed completely. When he set it back down in it's hole to try and figure out how to unhook it, the sensor read the water level as high and kicked the pumps back on.

This alone somehow freed something up and what do you know the water level went down in seconds. Duane had me go ahead and turn anything with water on in the house to go ahead and flush out the crap that had been built up in there from the past day or so. After that we sealed everything up (I had actually noticed an odor before, but didn't know why) and found a rubber seal that was just moved upward on that far pipe so it wasn't tightly sealed going down through that big top cover.

He went ahead and jetted the service pipe up near the street to go ahead and free anything up since he was already there.

We think the cause may have been from my g/f and it recently having been that time of the month for her. I wasn't aware and she definitely wasn't aware that flushing those things down the toilet will clog up a setup like this in no time. So now that we know, hopefully we won't have this issue again.

So as of now, everything is working good and is sealed up tightly. Hopefully any hint of odor from the hole will be completely gone now.

[Pitbull1052]

James you should have given a warning with this last post I almost hurled my lunch all over my desk...... glad you got it fixed though....

[5.0calypso93lx]

James you should have given a warning with this last post I almost hurled my lunch all over my desk...... glad you got it fixed though....

Sorry about that lol. It's definitely gross what goes down in there.

[Pitbull1052]

just as gross as what comes outta the GF lol j/k