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2007ShelbyCobra
02-22-2010, 09:18 PM
House panel determines Toyota misled public
02/22/2010, 4:27 PMBy Mark Kleis
Toyota is set to attend a hearing tomorrow, but today the House panel has announced its findings based on the documentation it received from Toyota so far. According to the panel’s findings, Toyota repeatedly ignored the possibility that electronics could have played a role in unintended acceleration cases.


Henry Waxman and Bart Stupek, leading democrats from the House Energy and Commerce Committee, sent an 11-page letter to Toyota’s president of Toyota Motor Sales U.S.A., Jim Lentz, outlining the findings from the investigation. Waxman and Stupek said that Toyota relied on a flawed study and wrongly dismissed the possibility of computer related sources for unintended acceleration, and then made misleading statements to the public concerning repairs made to the affected vehicles.

The findings were based on more than 75,000 pages of documents subpoenaed by the committee, including 20,000 pages in Japanese.

The committee also found that Toyota bragged in internal documents that it had saved $100 million by negotiating with regulators and limiting the 2007 Toyota Camry and Lexus ES recall concerning unintended acceleration. These were the same vehicles later named in the multi-million vehicle recall in late 2009.

In addition to the committee finding Toyota at fault, the committee also sent a letter to transportation secretary Ray LaHood, noting concerns that the investigations into Toyota’s problems were questionable at best.

“NHTSA’s response to complaints of sudden unintended acceleration in Toyota vehicles appears to have been seriously deficient,” the committee said in a letter to transportation secretary Ray LaHood. “Our preliminary assessment is that Toyota resisted the possibility that electronic defects could cause safety concerns, relied on a flawed engineering report and made misleading public statements concerning the adequacy of recent recalls to address the risk of sudden unintended acceleration.”

One possible reason may be the fact that NHTSA lacks any electrical or software engineers, leaving them ill-equipped to properly handle the investigations into the vehicles’ computers and electronics. NHTSA has received over 2,600 complaints related to unintended acceleration in Toyota products since 2000, which are attributed to no less than 34 deaths. In 2004, when Toyota began using a throttle-by-wire system, the number of incidents reported jumped by 400 percent.

The committees’ findings certainly go both ways, as NHTSA was documented as having also dismissing the possibility that even floor mats could have been a possible cause for the unintended acceleration. A former NHTSA official, who now works for Toyota, said in August 2007 that he witnessed NHTSA officials dismiss floor mats as a possible cause when it was introduced during a meeting.

“When I told them [I was there] for the ES350 floor mats, they either laughed or rolled their eyes in disbelief.”

BigBadStang
02-22-2010, 10:45 PM
Anyone that actually thinks for themselves, will find this news NOT a shocking revelation.
I'm waiting to see if Mr. Toyoda does the classic 'honorable Asian CEO', and kills himself...I don't think he will, but I will be waiting and watching. :lol:

94tchikinv8
02-23-2010, 07:37 PM
Personally I don't like toyota, but at this point, I think our government is trying to keep this stuff in the headlines for GM and Chrysler's sake. If they keep toyota down, maybe they can pick up a little market share and pay back uncle sam a little sooner.

-Rob

beefcake
02-23-2010, 11:33 PM
Personally I don't like toyota, but at this point, I think our government is trying to keep this stuff in the headlines for GM and Chrysler's sake. If they keep toyota down, maybe they can pick up a little market share and pay back uncle sam a little sooner.

-Rob

toyota has been covering shit up for years and the media has bought into their propoganda

american car companies have been getting the shaft and no love from the media at all, anytime anything goes on with the big 3, the media rubs their face in the dirt

BigBadStang
02-23-2010, 11:44 PM
^^^^^You got that shit right! Preach it brutha!

RIXXX93GT
02-24-2010, 04:15 PM
Yea what he said. Looks like the japanese automakers may not be the big media darlings anymore. I am shocked every day I read more about this in the media, just not used to hearing Toyota painted in a negative light.

85_SS_302_Coupe
02-24-2010, 04:21 PM
I'm personally tired of people justifying this by saying "oh well Ford did it with the Pinto and Explorer and blah blah blah". Two wrongs don't make it right.

djom1cincy
02-24-2010, 05:08 PM
I'm personally tired of people justifying this by saying "oh well Ford did it with the Pinto and Explorer and blah blah blah". Two wrongs don't make it right.
What are you whining and ranting about? Yes they used a bad part on hundreds of thousands of cars. A part they didn't know was going to be bad. They are working to fix the problem and make it right. If it wasn't for the government having stake in Chevy and Chrysler they would be setting back saying nothing. Instead the government is on capital hill running off at the cock holsters saying this and that with investigations going on driving the media crazy. It is no worse than what the big three has done in the past. The only difference is Toyota is standing in front of the customers saying sorry about the fuck up they will make it better. Blah blah blah

sean
02-24-2010, 05:14 PM
When I sold cars i got so sick of hearing how great toyota was. I got blue in the face explaning why they werent so great. Hopefully I can find a good job in car sales again and when I do maybe this will shut that up a bit.

beefcake
02-24-2010, 05:30 PM
What are you whining and ranting about? Yes they used a bad part on hundreds of thousands of cars. A part they didn't know was going to be bad. They are working to fix the problem and make it right. If it wasn't for the government having stake in Chevy and Chrysler they would be setting back saying nothing. Instead the government is on capital hill running off at the cock holsters saying this and that with investigations going on driving the media crazy. It is no worse than what the big three has done in the past. The only difference is Toyota is standing in front of the customers saying sorry about the fuck up they will make it better. Blah blah blah

Not completely true. They knew they had a bad part last year

"An internal Toyota document dated last July says the company saved $100 million in 2007 by getting the government to OK replacing floor mats in 55,000 vehicles as a solution to sudden acceleration complaints.
It's listed under "wins for Toyota — safety group" in the report, which is among documents obtained by a subpoena from the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform.

That and other references to saving money on safety issues raise the question of "whether Toyota was lobbying for less rigid actions from regulators to protect their bottom line," said Kurt Bardella, spokesman for the committee's ranking Republican, Darrell Issa of California"

here is a link to the documents

go to page 7

http://i.usatoday.net/money/_pdfs/10-02-22-toyota.pdf

85_SS_302_Coupe
03-04-2010, 05:27 PM
What are you whining and ranting about? Yes they used a bad part on hundreds of thousands of cars. A part they didn't know was going to be bad. They are working to fix the problem and make it right. If it wasn't for the government having stake in Chevy and Chrysler they would be setting back saying nothing. Instead the government is on capital hill running off at the cock holsters saying this and that with investigations going on driving the media crazy. It is no worse than what the big three has done in the past. The only difference is Toyota is standing in front of the customers saying sorry about the fuck up they will make it better. Blah blah blah


Yep. http://www.optimum.net/News/AP/Article?fmId=2601112


Drivers complain that Toyota's fixes didn't work
DETROIT, Wed Mar 03, 07:56 PM



At least 15 Toyota drivers have complained to U.S. safety officials that their cars sped up by themselves even after being fixed under recalls for sticky gas pedals or floor mat problems, according to an Associated Press analysis.

BigBadStang
03-05-2010, 07:44 AM
I've been saying all along that it will eventually come to light that this is an electronic/electrical problem.

02mingryGT
03-05-2010, 10:11 AM
Remember Pearl Harbor. Japs can't be trusted. They've been lying for months about how it was only a floor mat or throttle linkage. They've let people die to save money, albeit stupid people who don't know how to turn a key off but I'm sure someone loved those stupid people just the same. They're going to get their asses sued off and the government is just trying to protect itself by acting "appalled".

BigBadStang
03-05-2010, 12:25 PM
I guess most people just don't really understand how a car works, or they freak out and panic. The smart thing would be to just put the car in neutral. The rev limiter will keep the engine from blowing up, and you would still have power steering and power brakes.

We can probably expect a new gov't mandate of a 'brake throttle override' system on all cars soon.

02mingryGT
03-05-2010, 01:29 PM
I guess most people just don't really understand how a car works, or they freak out and panic. The smart thing would be to just put the car in neutral. The rev limiter will keep the engine from blowing up, and you would still have power steering and power brakes.

We can probably expect a new gov't mandate of a 'brake throttle override' system on all cars soon.

Oh yeah......government officials think they are smarter than Darwin's law. It is inevitable though.

And your right neutral is a better idea. I had a 1992 S10 Blazer stick the accelerator on me on the highway. First thing I did was put it neutral(no limiter) so I put it back in drive and applied the brakes until I could get across three lanes of traffic and get in the emergency lane.