Let's talk Tow Vehicles!

[Black Horse]

Here's my question:

What type of pick-up truck would you prefer for towing? Gas Powered or Diesel Powered?

Consider the cost of fuel, maintenance, cost of the vehicle, performance, longevity, etc.


I have been a long time fan of the diesel, but the economy and the amount I use it, coupled with the additional costs (purchase/maintenance) plus the fuel mileage are making me reconsider.

What are your thoughts?

[mustangboy]

I would still go diesel hands down. They make way more power, get better gas mileage, will run forever and most importantly have much better resale value. What you pay extra for up front you will more than make up on the back end when you sell it.

[Jeff88coupe]

I think it really all depends on your situation....towing distance/weight. If your just towing an open trailer no more than a few hours driving distance....gaser hands down. But if your towing a 12K#+ enclosed/RV all over the place...diesel. I have an '05 Chevy 2500 ext. cab with the duramax/allison setup. I love it...tons of power/decent gas mileage. I tow my car on an aluminum open trailer (~4500# total)...can hardly tell you have the trailer hooked up going down the road. I would like to upgrade to an enclosed trailer someday...so I know I already have plenty of truck to tow one with. I do mainly only drive it when I need to haul/tow something...which is why it's an '05 with <13K miles on it. So the fuel cost isn't such a huge issue with me yet. Being that I have a degree in chemistry (may as well use that piece of paper for something)..I'm seriously looking into making my own biodiesel to run in my truck. My '92 beater honda gets the daily driver abuse...220K+ so far.

[03silversnake]

i was forced to buy an 08 f450 because my 07 6.0 blew up on the way to bradenton. i got 5.2 miles per gal. pulling a 32 ft. trailer at $3.90 a gallon buy a gas i would have if the dealer had one.

[Jeff88coupe]

i was forced to buy an 08 f450 because my 07 6.0 blew up on the way to bradenton. i got 5.2 miles per gal. pulling a 32 ft. trailer at $3.90 a gallon buy a gas i would have if the dealer had one.

I have heard of the newer F450's getting horible milage..partly due to the steep rearend gears needed to pull the rated towing capacity, partly due to ford's ecu tune/epa exhaust emmition requirements with the new ULS diesel fuel. But 5mpg:eek:. I get ~14mpg towing ~5K# at ~75mph.

[SMOKE]

If you are going to be pulling often, I would go with a diesel. Otherwise, I would probably go the gas route. I have a 2007 F-150 with the 5.4L, I don't pull very often, but I pulled a trailer that full weighed in the neighborhood of 10,000lbs and it was making the truck work pretty hard going uphill and even on the highway you could tell it was working HARD, you just don't have to make your truck work like that if it's a diesel. My Dad has a '97 7.3L F-350 and it's like driving normal even with a 18,000 lb camper trailer pulling behind it.

My vote is gas, UNLESS you are using it ALOT then diesel is definately the better way to go.

By the way, here is my truck:

[RACEME]

I really like my F350 with the 7.3 diesel. It handles the towing way better than my 5.4l expedition.

[Gene]

If you're going to be running a travelling race series (NASA, NMRA, SCCA, etc), I would buy a diesel. But I would also buy a ten year old Civic for a daily driver.

If you're just buying a truck to haul the car to Tri-State or Edgewater, I'd either buy a gas truck, or buy a ten year old diesel and a ten year old Civic.

If I was daily driving a diesel, I'd be brewing biofuel in my backyard as well. I think it would be a ton of fun to buy an old diesel Mercedes wagon and run in on biofuel.

[Black Horse]

I think the do-it-yourself biodiesel is cool (I love the smell of following a truck that smells like french fries) but I think this will be a short lived deal. Once more and more folks start doing it themselves, unless you own your own greasy spoon or McDs you wont be able to obtain it, or McDs will be selling it. Its a matter of time before the regs and the lawyers get involved with some stupid liable suit as well.

[Gene]

I think the do-it-yourself biodiesel is cool (I love the smell of following a truck that smells like french fries) but I think this will be a short lived deal. Once more and more folks start doing it themselves, unless you own your own greasy spoon or McDs you wont be able to obtain it, or McDs will be selling it. Its a matter of time before the regs and the lawyers get involved with some stupid liable suit as well.

I have no issues with them selling the raw materials. Even if it makes the cost of production $2-2.50 a gallon to make your own, it's still cheaper than buying petroleum-based diesel, plus it's better for the environment.

You can already buy biodiesel at the pumps. There are a handful of stations around here that sell it. http://www.nearbio.com/

I'm a big supporter of Biodiesel and E85...anything that reduces our dependence on petroleum.

[pegasus]

im going with a ford 300 6cly and a stick shift

[ponymom05]

I have a 2000 F250 Super Duty Diesel with about 215,000 miles on it. It has been upgraded somewhat, Craigels could fill you in. Probably one of the best running and most reliable trucks in the area. It has been everywhere towing. It towed the Pinks car in an enclosed trailer to Kansas and back (Oh wait, SBZ forgot how the car got there and back) w/o any issues. It took about $550 in fuel for that round trip, didn't think that was too bad. Mine is the one the guys call for to come "rescue" them. It is a hoss. It is also a daily driver. We love it, wouldn't trade it for anything.

[fastone]

I have no issues with them selling the raw materials. Even if it makes the cost of production $2-2.50 a gallon to make your own, it's still cheaper than buying petroleum-based diesel, plus it's better for the environment.

You can already buy biodiesel at the pumps. There are a handful of stations around here that sell it. http://www.nearbio.com/

I'm a big supporter of Biodiesel and E85...anything that reduces our dependence on petroleum.

Don't know if anyone on here is using or has used bio-deisel, but I know for a fact, Kenton Cty Public Works/MX was using this, had all kinds of problems with fuel filter, crap in the fuel, among other things. They switched back and are not having any problems. Also Ford says not to use it, if you do, use a very low mix, if you use home-made or high cont. of bio-diesel, don't look to them for warr. work on your diesel!!!!

[89notch]

(Oh wait, SBZ forgot how the car got there and back)

I dont really know how I should take this. I'm kind of shocked really I didnt know there was an issue. PM me if there is a problem

[89notch]

I just picked up an 04 F250 6.0 FX4 and I love it but I would also like to pick up a TDI jetta as a daily driver so I can use my bio-diesel in it also :cool1: I got 16mpg last tank and I towed a trailor for about 100-125 miles of that tank.

[Black Horse]

What kind of gas mileage are you guys with gasoline motor getting when towing?

[bobtsgt]

I forget what we did with the father in laws 2006 F250. Pulling a open trailer with the green car I couldn't feel anything behind me. The 5.4 pulled it with ease. And thats with the bed loaded with a bunch of crap. MPG wasn't that bad. I think we did less then 1/4 tank from our house/to tristate/and back.

[NXcoupe]

I used to run FFW with my renengade car and towed it all over creation with my 98 Dodge 360 gas auto. It was the largest pos for towing I have ever owned. I wanted a 3/4 ton but my buddy talked me out of it at the dealership. It would go down to 30 mph going up Jelico mountain on the way to FL. I finally got rid of the pos after the lease was up, 13 mpg highway without towing, 7 to 8 mpg towing. I bought an 03 diesel F350 four door long bed auto and started towing with it. It got 17 mpg towing or empty. Didn't matter it seemed. It accelerated up Jelico mountain with 3 people, my car and a full bed of parts and junk. I would always use a diesel to tow with, my gas experience hasn't been that pleasant. I currently have a 95 F250 7.3 and get 18 mpg out of it around town, haven't really calculated a long haul with it. I bought it used after my divorce since I had to get rid of the F350, and sunk a bunch of money in it getting it roadworthy, so be careful if you buy used.

[thecollector]

I have a 98 ram with a 5.9 gas/auto 2wd and 3.90 diff. Towing a small enclosed trailer around the city with lawn equipment I'm lucky to get 9 mpg's. without the trailer I pull about 14 mpg's. I borrowed a cummins for a little over a week and got 19 mpg's towing and 21 empty. I compared these doing the same exact account route each time. The added cost of the fuel is more than offset by the increased economy, increased resale value and superior service life.... From my experience, my next truck will have glowplugs.

Ford is expected to come out with a F-150 sporting a small powerstroke soon. Dodge has already anounced a diesel for the 1500's coming out in the late summer as an 09'. It should be interesting to measure up the performance of these to their 3/4 and 1 ton brethern.

[Timido]

My excursion gets about 12ish towing open trailer and the Capri. It is big and comfy. I did the math the other day about 10,000 miles between a Dodge that gets 18mpg and my 12mpg Excursion. I forget what gas and diesel cost at the time but the Diesel was .60 cents a gallon higher and cost $500-$600 less a year at 10,000 miles. I got a good deal on my Excursion at the time and if I had to replace it I would get a Diesel.

[SMOKE]

What kind of gas mileage are you guys with gasoline motor getting when towing?

I get 12-13 MPG when pulling a trailer with my F-150

[dedpedal]

With the cost of fuel (gas and diesel) Im going with this as soon as I find one.


http://www.dailyhaha.com/_pics/strong_woman.jpg

[Mista Bone]

poor amy

[INSANEBA]

Don't know if anyone on here is using or has used bio-deisel, but I know for a fact, Kenton Cty Public Works/MX was using this, had all kinds of problems with fuel filter, crap in the fuel, among other things. They switched back and are not having any problems. Also Ford says not to use it, if you do, use a very low mix, if you use home-made or high cont. of bio-diesel, don't look to them for warr. work on your diesel!!!!

Kenton huh, I'm in Alger. I drive a 99 Dodge 1500 4x4 318 truck. I got 16.4 on my last trip to Milan, MI. without towing. I made the same trip with my 12' enclosed trailer, 2 drag bikes, a generator, starter cart, plenty of tools, and gear along with 3 other people and still pulled 14mpg. I hear alot of people complain about the 5.9's sucking fuel down, but as long as my little 5.2 git's er done, I'm leaving it alone. :bigthumbAllthough, there are pipe dreams of a supercharger to help with power later on...:D

[MFIELD]

I had a 03 silverado Z-71 and it got 19 not towing and between 15-16 towing about 4000#'s across WV an PA. It would climb the mountains 70 mph no problem.

[Foxxx5oh]

i havent pulled anything with my truck, but i have had a LOT of weight in the bed (more than a 99-04 mustang convertible if that says anything) and i could still take off in second gear, the ride actually IMPROVED and it pulled harder than my buddy's 06 F250 with close to the same amount of weight in it...its a shame i cant hold on to it, but with only 48XXX miles, it has another 400K left! thats REALLY hard to say about a gas motor...

[Katmandu]

Diesel. No brainer.

The Cost of Ownership is much more than the price of fuel. Folks are forgetting diesels have much higher RESALE values and depreciate much slower than gassers. This is a HUGE cost factor over the life of ownership!

My 1998 Ram 2500 has a 12 Valve Cummins in it. It just (on Monday) pulled around 350 HP and 813 lbs of TQ off Mike's new dyno.

Even with this much power, it gets a consistant 20 MPG. :bigthumb I've yet to tow with it, but most Cummins get high teens when towing.

Anyways, I'd rather be CUMMIN' than STROKIN' !! :eek: :lol: :bigthumb

Here's pics of my rig.... http://katmanduonline.net/pics/98_Ram/

.

[89notch]

Diesel. No brainer.

The Cost of Ownership is much more than the price of fuel. Folks are forgetting diesels have much higher RESALE values and depreciate much slower than gassers. This is a HUGE cost factor over the life of ownership!

My 1998 Ram 2500 has a 12 Valve Cummins in it. It just (on Monday) pulled around 350 HP and 813 lbs of TQ off Mike's new dyno.

Even with this much power, it gets a consistant 20 MPG. :bigthumb I've yet to tow with it, but most Cummins get high teens when towing.

Anyways, I'd rather be CUMMIN' than STROKIN' !! :eek: :lol: :bigthumb

Here's pics of my rig.... http://katmanduonline.net/pics/98_Ram/

.

What mods to the cummins?

[92coupe]

I just picked up an 04 F250 6.0 FX4 and I love it but I would also like to pick up a TDI jetta as a daily driver so I can use my bio-diesel in it also :cool1: I got 16mpg last tank and I towed a trailor for about 100-125 miles of that tank.



The 6.0 engines are junk, We have went through quit a few of them at work in a years time. The 7.3 on the other hand has held up very well the highest mileage truck with little to no major work has 430,000 and still strokin.

We just got 2 of the new 08 in stock with twins and they seem to be real strong.

[93cobra]

didn't even read what everyone else says.....
hands down no questions...if pulling an enclosed 24' & up
DIESEL PERIOD

if pulling an open...dosen't really matter....strong v6's to any v8's will work... depending on what performance you expect..

[93cobra]

The 6.0 engines are junk, We have went through quit a few of them at work in a years time. The 7.3 on the other hand has held up very well the highest mileage truck with little to no major work has 430,000 and still strokin.

We just got 2 of the new 08 in stock with twins and they seem to be real strong.

7.3 with 6 speeds are strong...autos that came in 7.3's are good until you pull more than 14K & then they start showing weekness

only 6.0s that really had any injector issues....were some 03 & 04's... and that was 1 out of 100

05's & up to the new twins are pretty bullet proof....

you will not find a stronger truck off the showroom with the automatics than the 6.0's & twins....6 speeds are strong too but the autos are so good in them vs the autos in the 7.3's its not even necessary to have a manual.

ive never been in a cummins or duramax that come close to impressing me like the powerstrokes.... (overall truck vs. truck...)

[89notch]

The 6.0 engines are junk, We have went through quit a few of them at work in a years time. The 7.3 on the other hand has held up very well the highest mileage truck with little to no major work has 430,000 and still strokin.

We just got 2 of the new 08 in stock with twins and they seem to be real strong.

They are hit or miss some people love them some hate. I love how the 6.0 runs versus the 7.3 we have a 99 F250 at the firehouse and its junk

[Katmandu]

What mods to the cummins?This is out of my Sig on DTR.

#10 TST Torque Plate, 3K GSK, BHAF, Timing 16.5*, MRBP Exhaust, Turbo Silencer Gone, KDP Killed, '03' Track Bar, DSS bar, 3.54 LSD gears, 285/70 Revos.

Maybe upgrading to 370 Marine Injectors down the road. :bigthumb

[Katmandu]

Someone did mention that Ford will be adding a diesel to the F150 line up.

I have an article (somewhere :rolleyes: ) Found it.

http://www.dieselforum.org/newsarticle/article/ford-will-offer-diesel-in-f-150/50/neste/35/





Ford Will Offer Diesel in F-150
By Richard Truett

DETROIT - Ford Motor Co. will launch its F-150 pickup with a diesel engine in 2008 or 2009, a former top executive confirmed.

If it arrives on time, the F-150 probably will be the first light-duty pickup with a diesel in North America.

Dave Szczupak, who retired last week as Ford's vice president of manufacturing for the Americas, said the F-150 will get a version of the 3.6-liter V-8 diesel used in the Land Rover Range Rover SUV sold in Europe.

Ford will be the first with the product unless Toyota or Nissan pulls off a surprise.

Gary Convis, Toyota's executive vice president of engineering and manufacturing for North America, said last month that Toyota had not yet sourced a diesel engine for the Toyota Tundra and might even buy one from a supplier. Nissan is negotiating with International Truck & Engine Corp. for a V-8 diesel for the Nissan Titan, but neither company has announced a deal.

New diesel

Ford F-150 diesel facts
-3.6-liter, 32-valve V-8 with electronically controlled twin turbochargers
-Estimated hp: 250-275
-Pro: The F-150 diesel would offer a fuel-efficient pickup to small-business owners and should help Ford retain overall truck sales leadership.
-Con: Ford officials worry it could cannibalize sales of the more profitable F-250 diesel.

GM eyes diesel engine

General Motors has announced plans for a small V-8 diesel truck engine after 2010. Dodge is expected to get new V-6 and V-8 diesels from longtime supplier Cummins in 2010.

Ford, GM and Dodge currently offer diesels only in their heavy-duty pickups.

The Range Rover's new diesel engine, developed with PSA/Peugeot-Citroen SA, was launched this year in Europe and looks like an ideal engine for a light-duty truck. The 267-hp V-8 develops 472 pounds-feet of torque - plenty of pulling power for consumers who might use a diesel F-150 to haul small trailers. The British market Range Rover gets 25 mpg.

Szczupak said a version of that engine would be used in the F-150. But engineers have to rework the engine to get it to conform to U.S. federal emissions standards.

"We haven't specified a Job 1 date, but we'll be pretty close by the end of 2008," Szczupak said of the 3.6-liter diesel.

Two major tasks

He said to get the engine U.S.-certified, Ford's diesel team has two tasks: First, it has to redesign some of the components to make the engine produce lower emissions in the cylinder. Then, team members have to choose a robust, reliable and affordable emissions system.

"There's a huge challenge for diesels in the under-8,500 (pounds gross vehicle weight) pickups in terms of meeting emission standards," Szczupak said.

Ford's diesel team has not made a final decision about the diesel F-150's emissions system, he said. Ford could go with urea injection to clean up harmful oxides of nitrogen, or NOx. The other option is a lean NOx trap. Both would be used with a diesel particulate filter.

"We will need a significantly more complex emission treatment and aftertreatment," Szczupak said. "We are looking at every option, whether it is a (urea) additive system or nonadditive."

Ford is determined to maintain sales leadership in full-sized trucks. The company has flirted with a light-duty diesel in the past but dropped plans when costs and reliability issues couldn't be reconciled.

[ibstrokin]

I know gm and ford are offering turbo diesel 1/2 tons in 09. The gm will be a 4.5l duramaxx designed and built in house (no isuzu). The ford will be a 4.4l.

[Carl]

Dave, get a diesel! My old F250 had the 5.4L in it...I towed the coupe to Bradenton with it....NEVER AGAIN! I can't wait to tow cross country with my new one. Only thing that sucks about diesel right now is price per gallon. But I'm sure that it will get a little better down the road.

[Katmandu]

You won't have a need for a tow vehicle if you buy THIS Cummins diesel! :eek:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cV0XJePUitI&NR=1

[replicobra]

what kills me is the fact that there are so many vehicles out there now, that get great mileage and others that still don't. i haven't towed any real weight with the lightning yet, but with 525 real wheel tq, i think it will do well. the bad thing is i'm averaging 11mpg anyway. that's acrossed the last 2 tanks of 93. i have a friend with an 05 hemi ram 1500, 4x4 who gets about the same. and i know someone on here with a 2500 chevy that's worse. if i had to tow much, i would want a deisle.

[INSANEBA]

Wow replicobra, that's sweet @ss tow truck! I actually saw a F-150 deisel about 3 months ago here in Lima. I think it was a tester for our local dealership or something because it was cruising around the dealerships block all day. It deffinitely tripped me out to pull up beside a half ton, and hear a diesel rattle when he took off. I'm intrested in the Dodge, and Chevy 1500 diesels for sure. Hell, everything that we have in the USA, is offered in a diesel model over in the UK. It's gonna make it's way over here before all is said and done...

[Katmandu]

the bad thing is i'm averaging 11mpg anyway. that's acrossed the last 2 tanks of 93. i have a friend with an 05 hemi ram 1500, 4x4 who gets about the same. OUCH ! :eek:

[Motorvation]

We had a 94 GMC 1500, and now have a 3500 duramax. The hills around us were a killer with the 94. It pulled great, but the mileage was bad. I don't know the exact mileage, but it made a big impact on the needle for one day. The Duramax doesn't even sweat. 223MPG empty, 19-20 in tow (open trailer). Both were 4x2 drivetrain. Waiting to see what it does with a 34+ foot GN. Maybe next year. Then we'll have to get all our junk running again.

[Katmandu]

The Duramax doesn't even sweat. 223MPG empty, 19-20 in tow (open trailer). Holy Sh!t man !! :eek: :eek: :eek: :lol: