Shotgun Recommendations

[Kevin Doe]

I am looking to buy a shotgun, but don't really know anything about them, or even where to look. I'm not new to guns altogether. I currently have a Smith & Wesson SW99 Compact in the 9mm version. I use that for concealed carry, and carry quite often. Its a very nice gun, and I've probalby put 7,000 rounds through it. I've also shot many many rifles, from SKS's, to Mausers.

I'd like a better gun for home defense, so I was thinking a .45 or a .357 mag revolver. Then I got an even better idea. I was thinking a very short barrel shotgun would be the ticket. I know sawed off shotguns are illegal, but I'm under the assumption that a 12" barrel is legal. Anyone know of any "tatical shotguns" with short barrels? I have no idea where to even begin looking for guns like this. I think the chambering of the cartridge would be make someone poop themselves, plus its something I've always thought it would be cool to have a shotgun, and I think it would be fun to shoot at the range.

I know there are a bunch of gun nuts on this site, so I figured here would be a good place to ask. If anyone has recommendations of what to look at I'd appreciate it. Or even if someone has something they want to get rid of.

[facemelter71]

First consider what you would like to have:
Automatic
Pump
Break down(over under,single shot)
Then go from there.Let me know,as i shoot my shotgun every tuesday night in a trap league and know a little bit about shotguns,and also i might be able to get ya a deal.

[mach_u]

This is what I am hoping to pick up shortly for home protection! :bigthumb
http://www.mossberg.com/products/default.asp?id=28

[Kevin Doe]

First consider what you would like to have:
Automatic
Pump
Break down(over under,single shot)
Then go from there.Let me know,as i shoot my shotgun every tuesday night in a trap league and know a little bit about shotguns,and also i might be able to get ya a deal.

Automatic? you mean semi? If I can get an auto shotgun, sign me up! LOL.

I honestly don't know which I'd prefer. I guess I'm looking ot stay under $500 as well. I'd say a breakdown is out of the question, so either pump or auto (semi).

[facemelter71]

The cruiser is what your lookin at? 12G?
The only thing that i ever had a problem with with the pistol grip shotguns is that there is alot of force on your wrist when you fire it.If any thing after you buy it just shoot it alot with a light load.When you fire it you really have to hold it with your left hand on the pump lever.

[facemelter71]

Yea semi automatic,as fast as you can pull the trigger.
If im gonna have a shotgun as home protection i would load it with -000- buck shot or something like that.

[mach_u]

The cruiser is what your lookin at? 12G?
The only thing that i ever had a problem with with the pistol grip shotguns is that there is alot of force on your wrist when you fire it.If any thing after you buy it just shoot it alot with a light load.When you fire it you really have to hold it with your left hand on the pump lever.
Yeah, I was looking at the 12G JIC Cruiser. I figured I'd keep light shot in it. I think at close range - it's still going to hurt a little... :lol: Anyway, didn't mean to hijack the thread!

[Kevin Doe]

Like I said, I'm totally uneducated in shotgun rounds (cartirdges?). I have heard about buckshot, birdshot, different "otts" 1/0, 3/0, etc, slugs, and heard a little about adjusting the spray pattern. I don't exactly know what they mean, but I assume birdshot is a bunch of small BBs, and the spray pattern is failry large. I assume buckshot is larger balls, with a much tighter grouping. I think the slugs are just a single piece of lead, and larger as the "otts" go up.

No real idea what 12 ga means. I know what gauges means in reference to wire size, so what does 12 ga mean in reference to a shotgun. I know 12ga wire is pretty small diameter.

Shit, the semi auto shotgun sounds fucking awesome really. I'm a lefty if that matter either. I know that came into consideration when buying my handgun. I had to have one with ambidexterious mag release.

[theyallslow]

I would say that a pump action would be better the a semi, in case that you have a misfire. cycle the gun and you are ready.

[Kevin Doe]

Isn't a semi just like a pump if you need to clear a round?

[facemelter71]

Well instead of moving the pump arm you would move the side slide on a semi auto.12Gauge is a standard shotgun size and round,20 gauge is also with 20 being the smaller caliber.In close range a very open choke like cylinder cylinder which is very open and will spread fast.
We can say that a 12 gauge round is as big around as a quater and the 20 gauge is as big around as a nickle.
The 20 gauge shotguns will be smaller,smaller barrel smaller stock and things like that.

[Kevin Doe]

Do you have any recommendations? Maybe a few for each type that I could check out?

How many rounds can these semis hold, and how many do the pumps hold, on average?

[facemelter71]

Your not that far from me,we could go up to bass pro shop up at the mall and check a few out if you want.Hands on is always the best.

[Kevin Doe]

Your not that far from me,we could go up to bass pro shop up at the mall and check a few out if you want.Hands on is always the best.

Do they have short barrel shotguns there? I figured they'd only carry hunting stuff, and nobody would want to use a shortbarrel for hunting. But yeah, if you're willing to meet up there, I'd be down with that. I live 1 minute from Bass Pro shops.

[facemelter71]

Yea they have some shortbarrels,besides if you ever wanted to switch to a longer one or short one they sell aftermarket barrels.

[facemelter71]

I work up at volvo on muhlhauser and i get off at 6,i need to run up there anyway.They have under armour boxer shorts.:bigthumb

[Kevin Doe]

Yea they have some shortbarrels,besides if you ever wanted to switch to a longer one or short one they sell aftermarket barrels.

When would be a good time/day to meet there? I can meet anytime. I coudl meet at early at 4:30 during the week, and anytime after that. On the weekends I'm open all day.

[facemelter71]

Probly tonight if your open for it.After 6.

[RACEME]

If it is for home defence, I think the pump is the most popular choice for most people. The most reconized sound in the world is a pump shotgun chambering a shell. You would most likely scare them long before you would ever pull the trigger.

[cstreu1026]

I bought a Remington 870HD for home defence. It has a shorter barrel and an extended magazine and was priced right at about $300 when I bought it. I have only taken it to the range once, 2 weeks ago, and I am nothing but happy with it.

[facemelter71]

One of my trap guns is a 870,shoots very well and has alot of rounds through it and still shoots great.

[ffmueller81]

I have a couple of 12ga shotguns.

I have a Mossburg 500 pump for hunting and home defense. It came with a cantiliver scope mount slug barrel and a vent rib barrel. the barrels are 26" long. I got it from Bass Pro last year for $250
http://www.mossberg.com/products/default.asp?id=3&section=products

My other gun is a Remington 1100 classic trap. It is a very nice gun for shooting trap and skeet. (I take it to Middletown gun club a couple times a year) It has a 30" long barrel with twin bead sights. This is only good for competition because it is too nice to take out in weather and too long for home defense. I got this one from shooters supply in Loveland for $850
http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model_1100/model_1100_classic_trap.asp


For what you are looking for, I would recommend a 12ga pump gun. They do make left handed guns that eject the shells from the opposite side but are a little harder to find. Just do some research, find something you like, and see if anyone has one in the area to shoot. I did that with both of my guns before I purchased.

[Black92LX]

Isn't a semi just like a pump if you need to clear a round?
no.

I would go with a 18" barrel. That is the shortest allowed by law with out having an ATF Tax stamp. A $200 one time fee
Yes shorter is legal but it is classified as an A.O.W (any other weapon) and a Tax must be paid. It's kind of a pain and not really worth it just for your standard home defense gun.

I would most defiantly go with a pump. Why because if someone comes in your house just hearing the 12 gauge rack most people won't stick around to hear the next sound it makes.
Secondly You can load up bucks and slugs and cycle them through dependent upon your need. That way you don't have to reload if you want a different shot just cycle it.
This too can be done with a Semi but is a little more difficult and a harder skill to learn.

I run a Mossberg 500 12 gauge. In my cruiser because of the positioning of the safety. Much more accessible for a quick switch then the Remingtion. I have to adjust my grip to get it especially with my Tactical gloves on. When I am running with a 12 guage I much prefer for the safety yo be on and I would rather not reposition my grip if i were to need to fire while running. It's a great gun and can be had for cheap.
In the house I have a Remington 870. Functions exactly the same as the Mossberg the safety is just in a piss poor position (my personal opinion).

I also have a Benelli Nova which i love!!! It's action is so freaking smooth it is unreal. Great Great Gun.
On my list though they are very hard to locate now that Heckler & Koch has stopped importing them is the Fabarms FP6. Great Great defense shotgun. Very light with a great action.

All of those can be had for $400 new except the FP6. Since they aren't currently imported though I have heard rumors that they have a new U.S. importer.

Here is the order that I would go with:
Fabarm FP6
Remington 870
Benelli Nova
Mossberg 500

All are great shotguns and trust my life with them no questions asked.
The Remington is by far the best built but all of these will stand up to anything you will put it thru as a home defense gun. I also have a load of other 12 guages from Single shots that are over 100 years old to a few semis. a 12 guage is a hard thing to make not a good gun. Hell even a Norinco (chinese made 12 gauge makes a fine boomstick)

As for how many rounds they hold. Most will come with a plug so it will hold 2 and 1 in the chamber. Remove the plug and you will hold 5. Most Home defense specific guns will hold 8. You can buy a mag extension for pretty much every 12 guage out there now.
But if you need 8 rounds from a shotgun in a home defense situation. You better have something else ready to roll.
Pumps and Semis hold the same amount of rounds.

[Kevin Doe]

But if you need 8 rounds from a shotgun in a home defense situation. You better have something else ready to roll.


Yeah, like a few flash grenades and samuri swords, or maybe an RPG. LOL


Thanks for all of your information. I appreciate your reply, and everyone else that replied as well. Thanks.

[Greg Seibert]

Black 92LX covered it very well.
A home defence gun gives you more confidence. Just knowing it's there goes along way.
I'd pick up the cheapest pump gun I could find at the gun and knife show (don't worry about cosmetics), practice and get comfortable with it.
Be sure everyone in the household knows where it's at, how to use it, and knows it's reason for being there.
Good Luck!

[Kevin Doe]

Facemelter71, give me a call on my cell, I can meet you up at Bass Pro. Give me a call and I can be there in 2 minutes.

OH yeha, my number is 324-1766

[93blacktruck]

get the aa12 so you can have 20 shots
http://youtube.com/watch?v=XoL3JVOGnKc
http://youtube.com/watch?v=F3v8AN_fJlQ

[DeckerEnt]

I have a Maverick 88. It is a cheap version of a Mossberg 500. Holds 7 + 1. In my opinion, perfect for home defense.
Keith

[1byafender]

I love my 870s for hunting and home protection

[RIXXX93GT]

Mossberg 500 pump with slug barrel and 00buck shot. Short , very reliable, they wont come back for more.

[5.0calypso93lx]

What did you end up getting?

[Kevin Doe]

Nothing yet. I have been doing a lot of interweb research though. There are literally eleventybillion 870 models, many of which seem pretty badass.

However, I'm probably going to trade my SW99 Compact 9mm for a Springfield XD .45 full size. Well, at least I'm considering it.

[cstreu1026]

Have you looked at the S&W MP models? I like them over the Springfield. I bought a M&P Compact in .40 S&W a month or so ago and so far I love it.

[Kevin Doe]

Have you looked at the S&W MP models? I like them over the Springfield. I bought a M&P Compact in .40 S&W a month or so ago and so far I love it.

Cincinnati Police use S&W MP 9mm. A friend of mine is a cincy cop, and we've went to the range and I put a lot of rounds through his, I really liked it. It sure is nice to have a longer barrel for accuracy. My 2" barrel isn't helping me too much on that front.

[pegasus]

Remington 870 express magnum 3 shells full of 00.buck at 6-10 feet youll have to mop the up off the floor

[one90gt]

I've got an 870 super mag (hold 3.5 inch shells) and love the gun. from everything ive heard the 870 is one of the most reliable shotgun designs ever. if mine was for home defense id probably get a shorter barrel. If you do end up buying a new 870 and stick with a shot barrel, you are going to want to get a very wide pattern choke (I think most come with a modified cyllinder choke which is a pretty tight pattern.)

[fastone]

http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model_870/model_870_express_synthetic_7-round.asp

Thats what I would buy, have seen mossburg's have problems...... for those in the law enforcement on here that use them..... any problems????? I have heard from some of the swat guys on this side of the river, (KY) that they have been to some training classes and the mossburgs always break!!!!! They have never had problems with remington, they have even tried damaging the 870 and still worked fine!!!! Just my .02 cents!

[Black92LX]

you are going to want to get a very wide pattern choke
I would disagree. You'll want to put all that Buck in the center of mass or you will just end up peppering them. Plus HD you don't need or want to cover a wide area like if hunting foul.

Full choke for the HD

[cstreu1026]

http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model_870/model_870_express_synthetic_7-round.asp

Thats the one I have.

[thrillrr]

You might also check out the winchester 1300 defender. I think that they just stopped making it but there should still be some out there.

Here's audio of a 12 gauge in action
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/audio/play/51381
Texas man kills burglars as 911 operator listens
Case may test state's self-defense laws

[Kwik92GT]

First choice for me would be an 870 with pistol grip, Knoxx stock, and a set of Wilson Ghost Ring sights. Something like this. http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j23/Kwik92GT/870HD.jpg

Second choice, really my first if money isn't an issue and you can find one, would be the Benelli M4 Tactical with short barrell. http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j23/Kwik92GT/BenelliM4.jpg


My next hand gun will most likely be an S&W MP in .45ACP. :bigthumb

[Black92LX]

You might also check out the winchester 1300 defender. I think that they just stopped making it but there should still be some out there.

Here's audio of a 12 gauge in action
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/audio/play/51381
Texas man kills burglars as 911 operator listens
Case may test state's self-defense laws

The Winchester 1300's action is terrible.

As for that guy. He should be in jail if not executed!! He in no way acted in self defense. He went outside and murdered those fellas no questions. Were the burglars right?? No but it does not give him the right to go and kill them.

[mach_u]

First choice for me would be an 870 with pistol grip, Knoxx stock, and a set of Wilson Ghost Ring sights. Something like this. http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j23/Kwik92GT/870HD.jpg
That looks awesome! How much would something like that run? Can you make those changes with just any 870?

[Black92LX]

For some reason folks want to add all these goodies and extras to a home defense gun.

Less is more when it comes to the home defense.

A pistol grip is nice but in a house you know you are going to be in close quarter pretty much anywhere you are. Say you are coming to the end of the hallway and the bad guy is waiting just at the end. You are going to have a hard time getting that barrel on him especially if he grabs ahold of it, since it will cross the opening before you see him.

You need to be able to rip that barrel out of his hands. With a pistol grip you lose the ease of twisting the gun to rip it out of his hands and then a quick jab to the face with the butt stock. If you only pull laterally which is what you will have to do with a pistol grip it is much easier for the badguy to hold onto the gun.

Just something to think about. Pistol grips are great combat shotgun accessories but home defense simplicity is where it is at.

[Kwik92GT]

That looks awesome! How much would something like that run? Can you make those changes with just any 870?
I've seen them in the $550 range like you see it. Knoxx has instructions on their site for changing out the stock. Knoxx Website (http://www.knoxx.com/index2.html)

I like the pistol grips myself. It was what I used while in the Corps and trained with, so it may just be a matter of personal preference.

[mach_u]

For some reason folks want to add all these goodies and extras to a home defense gun.

Less is more when it comes to the home defense.

A pistol grip is nice but in a house you know you are going to be in close quarter pretty much anywhere you are. Say you are coming to the end of the hallway and the bad guy is waiting just at the end. You are going to have a hard time getting that barrel on him especially if he grabs ahold of it, since it will cross the opening before you see him.

You need to be able to rip that barrel out of his hands. With a pistol grip you lose the ease of twisting the gun to rip it out of his hands and then a quick jab to the face with the butt stock. If you only pull laterally which is what you will have to do with a pistol grip it is much easier for the badguy to hold onto the gun.

Just something to think about. Pistol grips are great combat shotgun accessories but home defense simplicity is where it is at.
All good points but I just have my heart set on pistol grip. Call me weird I guess but I'm a fan. lol

[Black92LX]

All good points but I just have my heart set on pistol grip. Call me weird I guess but I'm a fan. lol

don't get me wrong the Pistol Grip has it's uses. Just my personal experience and opinion there are far too many situations in a home defense sitaution where i may need to butt stock someone

[02mingryGT]

The Winchester 1300's action is terrible.

As for that guy. He should be in jail if not executed!! He in no way acted in self defense. He went outside and murdered those fellas no questions. Were the burglars right?? No but it does not give him the right to go and kill them.

Just like these burglars??

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3136414

I say hell yes blow them bastards away.

[DeckerEnt]

If someone is in my home, threatening me or my family or even my dog or cat, he will leave in a body bag, but to go outside and shoot someone on some one else's property when he was safe and sound in his own home, that is wrong. Did the bad guys get what was coming to them, probably. That is the chance those guys took in that line of work.
There is a huge difference in fearing for your own life and vigilanty justice.
Holding the guys at gunpoint till the cops got there would have been a much better idea.
Keith

[Black92LX]

Just like these burglars??

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3136414

I say hell yes blow them bastards away.

THERE IS A HUGE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO!!!!!!!

The first scenario the burglars were in a home where no one was home. The neighbor witnessed the incident left his house went outside and shot 2 people that did not confront him or put him in danger in any form or fashion.

The second coming into someone's home and threatening their life.

Two totally different scenarios that require two completely different uses of force.

[WhiteT]

Just get an 870 and be done with it. I have probably 1000+ rounds through mine and never have had any problems. Can't beat the price either.

[88 beast]

a double barrel coach gun is a shorter shotgun but as for a hand gun the .40 cal. is pretty good for home defence and power also the ammo is everywere and cheap.

[88 beast]

if your set on a pistol grip my dad just got an awsome 12 ga. riot gun used by swat i can get the info on it if you want

[TZ250]

There are many good shotguns to buy. The 'right shotgun' is the one that you buy, shoot and practice with so that you and the shotgun are ready to go, if necessary.

We could compare shotguns forever (similar to the Ford vs. Chevy debate).

Of course cost is always a consideration. It's hard to beat an Rem. 870 or Moss. 590 for home protection AND value (performance/dollar). I have both. :lol: Both are basic, but have extended mag. tubes.

This isn't my picture, but this is the way my 870 HD looks.
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o267/TZ250_Fanatic/870_HD.jpg

One more thing, 12 ga. is the way to go for home protection. This website will keep you busy for a while! :D
http://www.theboxotruth.com/

[TZ250]

We also need to consider the way a jury will view a 'tactical', evil looking shotgun. Remember that the jury will know nothing of guns. Because of the tactical junk hanging on the shotgun, you will be painted as a viscious killer just waiting for someone to break in.

A regular looking shotgun would appear much better to the eyes of an uninformed jury. (especially with wood stock and no black parkerizing)

My $.02.

[DeckerEnt]

Think about this also. Most altercations usually only last seconds with only 2 to 3 rounds fired. Practice alot and know your defense plan for your home by heart. I would suggest clearing your home every once in a while. It will give you a working knowlege of your home. Do it with the lights off at night. After a few times, you will find all the tight spots and angles of fire that are safe.
Keith

[Greg Seibert]

Keiths right. And approaching the home from the outside as if you're the perp will school you on defence planning and what if senarios or "what would I do if" ideas to keep your home safe.

[02mingryGT]

If I had any faith in the Justice system then I would agree. Lets just say those guys(in Texas) will never have the opportunity to actually kill someone. The four in Miami will probably be back on the street in 20 years. I don't want to hijack this thread any longer so that will be my last response. Understand your points fellas. We just disagree.

[cstreu1026]

I always loved the looks of the 870 Marine Magnum. I just couldn't justify the extra cost to get the silver finish when I bought my 870.

[Black92LX]

If I had any faith in the Justice system then I would agree. Lets just say those guys(in Texas) will never have the opportunity to actually kill someone. The four in Miami will probably be back on the street in 20 years. I don't want to hijack this thread any longer so that will be my last response. Understand your points fellas. We just disagree.

Ohh trust me we are on the exact same page on our thoughts on the justice system.
but that does not make it right.

[Kevin Doe]

This website will keep you busy for a while! :D
http://www.theboxotruth.com/

You were right, I was looking around on that site for like 4 hours yesterday.