need advice on removing light scratches/swirls from clear coat

[ponyboystroker]

I want to clean up the finish on my '04 Mystichrome Cobra and I would like some opinions on what I should do. The clear coat has a lot of light swirl and scratches in it. I think either the previous owner or car lot buffed it and screwed it up, or waxed it with a buffer that had a dirty pad. I am kind of doubting that it was buffed because when I bought the car it was only two years old and only had 15K miles, and I don't know why you would buff a car that is that new.

I wanted to start out with the gentlest product that I can and then move up from there to remove the swirls/scratches. I used Meguiar's Polish on half of one of the quarter panels last week and it took a lot of the fine scratch/swirl out and the area that I did looks a lot better, but if you look close you can see some scratches are still there. So I want to know what I should try next, remember I don't want to jump right into an aggressive product.

[331TwistedWedge]

3M products are very nice ... try KOI/Wilcox ... chris (plated) should have some good advice for you ... i use 3M and it makes my car look like glass ... they have several types to choose from ... they cost a few bucks, but worth it :bigthumb

[Black Horse]

Zaino Brothers make a GREAT product for removing scratches and swirls in clear coat - I had scratches from cat claws on one fender and after a couple of applications they were gone!

Zaino's products rock - but are a bit expensive

www.zainobros.com www.zainostore.com

[ponyboystroker]

thanks for the replies guys. I am not overly concerned about the price of the products at this point. Are the products you guys speak of supposed to be on by hand? :dunno:

[5.0calypso93lx]

Most of the swirls in the clear coats of paints are caused by improper washing. If the car has EVER gone through a gas station or other other automatic car wash, even once, and its over.

Try www.autopia.org and do a search on poorboy's swirl remover kit, and porter cable. The poorboys kit starts with a very fine abrasive polish, and gets more coarse as you move up through the different stages.

[331TwistedWedge]

yes the 3M products you apply by hand ... there are different stages, via polish, wax, paint cleaners and such ... just ask one of the workers what will work the best on swirls ... advance, autozone and such WONT carry 3M ... you will need a KOI/Wilcox or some time of place that sells paint ... good stuff im my opinion ...

[Black Horse]

Zaino is hand applied, available by mail (not sure about retail in-stock anywhere - I really should look)

[OrangeStang04]

Hey Chris... The guy that owns this company is named Justin... http://www.obsessivedetail.com/

He will hook you up good with anything that you need.... I just bought a shit ton o' stuff from him and am waiting for a good time to use it on the pumpkin!

[IWRBB]

I have a PC polisher and the pads, I also have some nice compounds that are not very agressive and should do the trick. It's an assload of work though. You'll have to wash it, do the whole car with the compound, take it off, then go back and hit it with polish to bring the shine back, then put wax on since it'll be totally bare after compounding and polishing.

That car deserves to be scratch free. I'll let you at anything I have for free, but none of it is leaving my garage, you'd have to do it here and it would definately take hours. But, I do have a nice big garage :)

I ordered all my stuff from Classic Motoring Accessories (http://properautocare.com/) if you just want to go ahead and buy it.

The trick to avoiding swirls is to never wash it. Seriously. I think my car has been washed less than 10 times by hand in almost 5 years. Every time I washed it by hand I used a new or nealry new sponge. I do de-bug the front end and rinse the car down at a spray bay every month or so, but you'll never get any swirls until you start dragging stuff across it like sponges, wash mitts, and worst of all, the brushes at the spray bay. Those are completely loaded with grit.

Don't use a sponge dropped on the concrete, and don't put your sponge to the bottom of the bucket when you dip it back in, that's where any grit would be. Some guys use a soap bucket and rinse bucket to avoid grit in the soap bucket. They also sell a platic grid that goes in the bucket to keep the grit separated from the sponge.

Another trick is to never dry it by hand either, if you have enough wax, an electric blower will clear all the large panels in seconds. Clean up the corners and drips with a clean Absorber and it's done. If you don't have enough wax, it won't bead up and roll off, it will just spread. No, you won't blast rocks into the paint despite what some poeple think.

I know it all sounds so anal, but my car is almost 5 years old, has 12,000 miles, and the paint looks brand new. I guess it's all an overreaction to my 94 Mustang, which paint sucked bad, faded black and swirled. Even under flourescent lights, there are zero swirls or lines anywhere on the 03. And forget black.. DSG always looks clean.

BTW, Zaino Z5 will hide some of the swirls, but it won't get rid of them at all.

[ponyboystroker]

once again guys thanks for all the advice! :bigthumb

Nick, thanks for the link to obsessivedetail.com, should I tell him that you sent me? I will probably also contact him to see what he recommends. From what I saw I kind of like the Poor Boy's super swirl remover. I am also going to look into the zaino and 3M stuff before I make a final decision.

I am glad I posted here because all of the guys at svtperformance.com were telling me that I would need a Porter Cable, I guess this must be a killer product because they all swear by it. But anyway I don't want to have to buy an expensive buffer for just this one job, plus I don't really have any experience with a buffer and I don't think that I want to learn on this car.

I think I may follow this guy's advice from svtperformance.com minus the Porter Cable:

The PC when combined with the right products and pads removes very little if any clear. The PC works by reducing the edges of the swirls making them less visible and removing the smaller ones.

The standard regimen for a beginner is SSR2.5, SSR1, the Buffing Pad Starter Kit and some microfiber towels. After that, I would actually go with Red Moose Machine Glaze to add some depth and clarity. I'd finish it off with Poorboy's EX-P to give it shine. Both products will let the metal flake really pop out of the finish and enhance the color(s) of the mystichrome.

[ponyboystroker]

I have a PC polisher and the pads, I also have some nice compounds that are not very agressive and should do the trick. It's an assload of work though. You'll have to wash it, do the whole car with the compound, take it off, then go back and hit it with polish to bring the shine back, then put wax on since it'll be totally bare after compounding and polishing.

That car deserves to be scratch free. I'll let you at anything I have for free, but none of it is leaving my garage, you'd have to do it here and it would definately take hours. But, I do have a nice big garage :)

I ordered all my stuff from Classic Motoring Accessories (http://properautocare.com/) if you just want to go ahead and buy it.

The trick to avoiding swirls is to never wash it. Seriously. I think my car has been washed less than 10 times by hand in almost 5 years. Every time I washed it by hand I used a new or nealry new sponge. I do de-bug the front end and rinse the car down at a spray bay every month or so, but you'll never get any swirls until you start dragging stuff across it like sponges, wash mitts, and worst of all, the brushes at the spray bay. Those are completely loaded with grit.

Don't use a sponge dropped on the concrete, and don't put your sponge to the bottom of the bucket when you dip it back in, that's where any grit would be. Some guys use a soap bucket and rinse bucket to avoid grit in the soap bucket. They also sell a platic grid that goes in the bucket to keep the grit separated from the sponge.

Another trick is to never dry it by hand either, if you have enough wax, an electric blower will clear all the large panels in seconds. Clean up the corners and drips with a clean Absorber and it's done. If you don't have enough wax, it won't bead up and roll off, it will just spread. No, you won't blast rocks into the paint despite what some poeple think.

I know it all sounds so anal, but my car is almost 5 years old, has 12,000 miles, and the paint looks brand new. I guess it's all an overreaction to my 94 Mustang, which paint sucked bad, faded black and swirled. Even under flourescent lights, there are zero swirls or lines anywhere on the 03. And forget black.. DSG always looks clean.

BTW, Zaino Z5 will hide some of the swirls, but it won't get rid of them at all.

IWRBB,

I appreciate the invite to use your equipment and garage. :bigthumb But I am still scared of using a buffer because I don't know what I am doing. Have you ever used your PC on your Cobra? I hear you on being anal, out of all of the cars that I have owned this is the only one that has a nice body and nice paint job, or at least the paint job will be nice after I get the scratch/swirl out of it. Not washing it really does make sense. When I wash mine I usually take it to a do it yourself touchless car wash that way the only thing that touches the finish is water and soap. I also really like your idea about blowing a car dry; that is freaking brilliant! ;)

I will let you guys know what I figure out.

[ponyboystroker]

oh yeah I forgot to post pics. Here a couple of pics of what the finish looks like now. If you look at the reflection of the halogen lights you can see the scratches easier.

[IWRBB]

IWRBB,

I appreciate the invite to use your equipment and garage. :bigthumb But I am still scared of using a buffer because I don't know what I am doing. Have you ever used your PC on your Cobra? I hear you on being anal, out of all of the cars that I have owned this is the only one that has a nice body and nice paint job, or at least the paint job will be nice after I get the scratch/swirl out of it. Not washing it really does make sense. When I wash mine I usually take it to a do it yourself touchless car wash that way the only thing that touches the finish is water and soap. I also really like your idea about blowing a car dry; that is freaking brilliant! ;)

I will let you guys know what I figure out.

Yea, I've used it on my Cobra twice. I've done my mom's Cadillac with it and my F150 twice as well. No swirls, no scratches. It's really easy to use. Just put it on a medium speed and let the compound, pad and weight of the machine do the work. All you really do is move it and add compound to the pad as you go. It's really not much different than applying it by hand, it's just way quicker and easier. If you did want to stop by and use it, I'll show you how and get you started.

[Kevin Doe]

I also have the PC and Meguiars professional polishes. Worked WONDERS on my RX-7. Check out these pics of before and after. Don't mean to steal the thread, but this is what a DIYer can do with the proper products:

The paint looked like crap. At best I was hoping to save it from the booth.

Here are the pics: (these are after a wash, dry, and clay bar)
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7%20Paint/RX-7PaintAfterwashandclaybar7.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7%20Paint/RX-7PaintAfterwashandclaybar12.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7%20Paint/RX-7PaintAfterwashandclaybar4.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7%20Paint/RX-7PaintAfterwashandclaybar5.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7%20Paint/RX-7PaintAfterwashandclaybar6.jpg


Now, my process was this:

- #83 with Sonus SFX-1 pad on the G100. Speed setting 5. Four applications on the horrizontal surfaces, three applications on the vertical.

- #80 with Sonus SFX-2 pad on the G100. Speed setting 5. One application.

- #7 with Sonus SFX-2 pad on the G100. Speed setting 3.5. One application.

- #21 with Sonus SFX-3 pad on the G100. Speed setting 3. Three applications on horrizontal surfaces, two on vertical surfaces.

After pics:
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7%20Paint/RX-7photoshoot11-14-063.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7%20Paint/RX-7photoshoot11-14-062.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7/RX-7photoshoot11-14-0627.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7/RX-7photoshoot11-14-0623.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7/RX-7photoshoot11-14-0616.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l55/Kevin_Doe/RX-7/RX-7photoshoot11-14-064.jpg

[ponyboystroker]

IWRBB,

Once I decide on the product that I am going to use I am going to call the manufacturer and if they say it has to be put on with a buffer I will be taking you up on your offer to start me out and show me what to do. Once again thanks for the invite. :coo1:

Kevin Doe,

That is crazy how your paint came back after the buff job. If you would have showed me those pics before the buff job I would have told you that there was no way in hell that paint would ever look good again. Did the results last for a long time? Were you experienced with the buffer before this project?


Thanks for the support guys. :bigthumb

[IWRBB]

That's cool, just shoot me a PM when you are looking to do it. I have a few new pads for the PC still. We can use one for the swirl removing compound, one for the polish, and one for wax. That way we don't have to try to clean and dry a single pad between steps.

[ponyboystroker]

That's cool, just shoot me a PM when you are looking to do it. I have a few new pads for the PC still. We can use one for the swirl removing compound, one for the polish, and one for wax. That way we don't have to try to clean and dry a single pad between steps.


sounds good, I'll let you know.

[IWRBB]

oh yeah I forgot to post pics. Here a couple of pics of what the finish looks like now. If you look at the reflection of the halogen lights you can see the scratches easier.

Damn, I missed the pic. That IS bad. There are more swirls on 1 sq.in of your car than my entire car. That type of stuff should come right out though.

[ponyboystroker]

That's cool, just shoot me a PM when you are looking to do it. I have a few new pads for the PC still. We can use one for the swirl removing compound, one for the polish, and one for wax. That way we don't have to try to clean and dry a single pad between steps.


Are there different pads with different types of material for certain products? If I need to buy some pads that would not be a big deal to me.

[IWRBB]

Yea, the pads are also part of what does the work. They are more to less agressive to go along with the more to less agressive compound, polish, & wax. If you look at what Kevin did, he used one type of pad for all the first stage, a second type for the two middle stages, and a third for the final wax.

Like I said, you can use the ones I have if you want, but you might just want to pick some up since they have improved on them of the last year or so.

I'd probably pick up these now:
http://www.properautocare.com/hi612infopaa.html
Yellow for the first step, white for the second, and red for the wax. One of each should do fine, maybe two yellows.

They have kits too:
http://www.properautocare.com/ne65inccstef.html

Looks like the ones I have are 'old school' now, they are on closeout.

[Kevin Doe]

I was not expereinced with the PC before I did my car. I just read up on how to use it and used common sense. The results would last forever. The method I used does not cover scratches, it removes them by removing a small layer of the clear. The same scratches will never come back, but new scratches could obviously get there.

[ponyboystroker]

I was not expereinced with the PC before I did my car. I just read up on how to use it and used common sense. The results would last forever. The method I used does not cover scratches, it removes them by removing a small layer of the clear. The same scratches will never come back, but new scratches could obviously get there.


The reason I asked is because my brother did something on the decklid of his '68 Cougar that he had and it looked great, but later the paint looked dull again. Now that I think about it he may not have actually used a buffer, but rather put some crap on by hand.

I was also planning on looking around the 'net for some info on the use of the PC. Do you recall any sites that were extremely helpful?

[bobtsgt]

wanna do mine after your chris :D

[ponyboystroker]

wanna do mine after your chris :D

how about we do yours first so we can learn on it. :lol:

[bobtsgt]

fine by me. can't hurt my paint anymore :D